audio-talk

Cressy Snr wrote: ↑Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:43 pm

Thermionic Idler wrote: ↑Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:36 pm Just noticed this thread - sorry I haven't been onto the forum for ruddy ages as had some more urgent issues to deal with - I've managed to find another job now so that panic is over and done with.

Well done Dave, bet you are relieved.

Good to hear you are still enjoying the big Mets.

Cheers Steve. Somewhat relieved, it's a year's contract and I'm hoping my former employer will be able to take me back at some stage, but we'll see.

The big Mets have been working perfectly for us and with the big OTLs behind them, I think we'll struggle to do a lot better frankly. I'm done with messing with the hi-fi for the moment which is why I've been quiet lately. We're just sitting back now and using it. Possibly upgrade the DAC at some point but it's more or less done for at least the medium term.

Point of note, the heat output from the Beasts has actually not been too much of an issue this summer. Which is also nice.

Nice to see you posting dave.
I emailed Owston last week to see what dates are available for May next year, as yet no reply..

Great news about landing the job Dave and hopefully something longer-term will fall into place in the meantime.

Audio systems are for listening too, aren't they!

steve

ffs man up

lol

we need it this year man

september or november is good

As desirable as it is, to wish for a opportunity to get out and enjoy a Interest.
With the recent reports on the Pub's reopening, this Year is looking like a a Unknown for Booking Events,
as there is already Pub's Shutting Down only days after reopening, furthering the businesses concerns for their turnover.
I can only assume the information made known, to enforce the decision to close has come from Track and Trace.
Also then the knock on effect, how many customers are coming back.

It would be a risk to be assessed by the premises owner, if a Pub Venue was to use its Function Room Facility,
and then possibly have as a result, have to shut the daily bread and butter side of the business,
if a Track and Trace report shows a one time visitor has been flagged up as a concern .
That's the Devils Advocate bit done.

If Dave's willing to embrace a Social Distancing Marshall Role, if it is still a requirement for the next Owston maybe he could also assist with the fitting of the additional separation measures, as seen in the Link.


https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Outdoor-Huma ... SweMNeyJw2

They would work s treat john..

One of my favourite Owston memories was watching Nick and a few others assemble a working 833A SET from parts that had never seen each other before. Getting that thing up and running required a few smart minds and brave hands (the HT ended up at 2KV, IIRC, so someone put a turntable dust cover over most of the capacitor bank) working away around a table for a while, and the results were excellent.

While such ambitious projects aren't essential for a good meet-up, I do think that having to keep a distance, avoid shaking hands, etc would put a damper on things.


I can say that, from a booking of events perspective, my calendar for live events has been wiped comprehensively, apart from one in November that's clinging on for now. As a result, I've decided to find other work until the events industry recovers.

I'm looking forward to the next Owston, and have some interesting stuff to show, but I'd rather wait until the time is right and we can do it properly.

Chris

That was me and Nick, I messed up a few times joining it up. Nick brought the ACF2 complete with balanced level shifting power supply to drive the 833 I brough the 833 output stage, filament heaters good Tribute OPT’s and the output stage B+ supply.

I was very pleased with outcome. But Pops brought his version same day I think and it held its head high aswell.

A big part of the quality of an 833 is the valve. Ive never heard an 833 amp I didn’t like.

Doesn’t really matter if you buy nos Western 833s which I use, or Pops uses the Russian equivalent GU48 which sounds great also. But I wouldn’t buy a Chinese production. Not worth the risk Russian military version is a known quality part that sounds good. No need to look at China.

We used to get nos in UK that came from hospital diathermy machines. They’ve probably started using solid state for diathermy by now so supplies of nos probably poor these days. Diathermy makes you want to reach for some pork scratchings.

Good info, Paul. Thanks.


I've had a thought: there's something I'd like to try at Owston. It'd be a bit of work to set up, and would probably require quite a bit of space to pull off properly - maybe an end wall. The idea is this: set off with a live multi-track recording and, instead of mixing it down to stereo, bring enough speakers and amplifiers for each instrument or voice, and then physically place the speakers in order to achieve a stereo image.

It would be a bit of an experiment, I suppose, and I'd only bring such a contraption along if enough of us were interested in what the results might be.

Thoughts?

Chris

There was someone at crannage a couple of years ago that was trying to do that with a string quartet. He was very enthusiastic (that’s probably another way of saying mad as a box of frogs). He seemed to not be aware that other forms of music existed.

Nick wrote: ↑Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:49 pm There was someone at crannage a couple of years ago that was trying to do that with a string quartet. He was very enthusiastic (that’s probably another way of saying mad as a box of frogs). He seemed to not be aware that other forms of music existed.

Yes, I was there and was quite impressed with what he managed to achieve, setting aside all the impracticalities of what he had done when considering average domestic listening. The more questions I asked, the more he constantly told me he would not answer my questions in order to ‘protect the secrecy and special individuality of his product’. Yes, it did sound very good. Yes, it had no place domestically apart from a dedicated listening space. Yes, he was as mad as a box of frogs!

Well, I'd be happy to answer any questions that might come up. I don't think there's anything technically difficult or weird that might apply, so no secrecy here.
I was thinking more like 8 channels and a subwoofer, though. Four seems a little pedestrian.

Question for the audience: in the case of a drum kit, the mics on the toms etc tend to be pointing down towards the drum skins. Does that mean the speakers should be pointing upwards?

I'm trying to figure out what would illuminate the room's acoustics in the most realistic way.

Chris

Well, the drum (or drum kit as a whole) will be behaving as a complex number of sound sources each of which will generate a wave front that expands into the recording studio. The microphone will sample that wave at a distance from the source and record the pressure variation at that point. So I guess the best you could do is create a point source emitter (of some sort) and compensate for the distance of the microphone by pulling the signal forward in time from some arbitrary time reference for the recording. And then repeat for each sound source.

In other words I think a crossed pair of mikes, and pair of speakers might do as good (or no worst) job. Fun to try though.

Nick wrote: ↑Mon Jul 13, 2020 9:28 am
In other words I think a crossed pair of mikes, and pair of speakers might do as good (or no worst) job. Fun to try though.

fwiw I spent a long time recording individual heads with resonably expensive capsule mics, which I spent ages mixing into correct positions and trying to remove all the bleed and crossover........This was fine until one day I tried crossover at a distance...never looked back

easy and effective, what's not to like

Nick wrote: ↑Mon Jul 13, 2020 9:28 am Well, the drum (or drum kit as a whole) will be behaving as a complex number of sound sources each of which will generate a wave front that expands into the recording studio. The microphone will sample that wave at a distance from the source and record the pressure variation at that point. So I guess the best you could do is create a point source emitter (of some sort) and compensate for the distance of the microphone by pulling the signal forward in time from some arbitrary time reference for the recording. And then repeat for each sound source.

In other words I think a crossed pair of mikes, and pair of speakers might do as good (or no worst) job. Fun to try though.

Ah, but what of the mic position? If the mic is facing downwards, it's capturing sound that's going upwards. If we want to make it sound like that instrument is in the room, perhaps an up-firing tweeter might be worthwhile. I'm not sure.
Delays can be applied arbitrarily, and mechanically (ie, move a speaker forwards) or electrically (the digital desk can put up to 100ms on any output).
I'm more thinking of each instrument/channel close-mic'd, and then perhaps make some attempt to re-introduce the directivity that the instrument may have had.

Thinking about it, that could get really complex really quickly. It might be easier just to hire the musicians.


Coincident mics are one approach to stereo sound, but I'm not convinced they're the best approach: they only capture left-to-right level differences, not time differences. As a result, something that's supposed to be 70% to the left will have the appropriate level difference when played back through speakers, but both speakers will produce the signal at the same time. I'm not certain that approach is an accurate way of recreating a stereo image.

Chris