The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

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Neal
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#256 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

How are you old bikers coping with ethanol based fuel on your ancient silver steeds?

Are you finding issues with modern fuels?
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Mike H
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#257 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Mike H »

Don't know if it's the ethanol, or something else, but what I found is if the carbs are left to dry out, which is what normally happens because the float chambers are open to atmosphere by vents, you get deposits, which build up and get worse over time, I've had horrible hard brown or green stuff, other people have had stuff that looks like a jelly. Carb cleaner barely touches it, usually has to be scraped off. Latterly the Guzzi had to have a complete set of new jets, 'cause the old ones were partially clogged, but I wasn't sure ho much and was loath to start shoving wires up 'em and buggering up the hole size. It got to the stage where if a bike was going to be left for a few days or more, I should drain the float chambers.

Another problem I've heard of, and sounds like it is ethanol related, is (plastic) floats swelling, and then jamming against the sides.
 
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#258 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

Thanks Mike, that’s interesting. Ive seen the green jelly/deposits in the Alfa carbs but that was when it was left for an extended period, it’s a bugger to clean out. The Ethanol content is up to 5% currently and due to rise up to 10% at some point so things will only get worse.

Apart from the corrosion issues associated with it, Ethanol at this level can cause weak mixtures as it contains oxygen and can burn slower creating hotter exhaust temps. IE more unburnt fuel enters the exhaust tract and self ignites. Lots of discussion about it on the classic car forums.
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#259 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Mike H »

Yes, the main problem now as far as I can tell (and I've mentioned this on other bike forums), modern petrol is not made for carburettors any more, but EFI systems. E.g. there's no evaporation because all parts containing fuel are sealed.

On the Moto Guzzi forums there are any number of stories about the plastic fuel tanks, which the newer V7 models had (but MG have latterly gone back to steel), swelling, to the extent that if you take the tank off, it won't go back on and the bolt holes won't line up! :shock:

Some tanks have been replaced under warranty, some owners have asked if it's possible to fit the newer steel tank onto an earlier model (made more complcated and expensive by the internal fuel pump being different and not transferable); some have tried filing the holes bigger (in one case, holing the tank!) or moving the rear bolt. But seems the simple answer is shave a bit off the front rubbers, then the rear bolt will line up.
 
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#260 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

Good point about the evaporation, one of the discussions has been around the volatility of modern fuel, it can vaporise at much lower temps than none ethanol fuel so if you get stuck in stop start traffic or stop for 5 mins to refuel the under bonnet temps rise and the car won’t restart or it runs very rough as some of the fuel vaporises in the carb itself...
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#261 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by pre65 »

I think super unleaded is the worst.

Had trouble with the KTM some while ago, and when I drained the carb what came out was like runny honey. :shock:

Now I drain the carb after use, easy on most bikes but not so on carb fitted cars. :cry:
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Neal
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#262 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

Look so like some but not all new or newish cars can handle the new E10 fuel....buy a BMW/Dacia/Volvo seems to be the underlying message, LOL!

https://www.acea.be/uploads/publication ... bility.pdf
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#263 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Dave the bass »

Neal wrote: Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:49 am
Are you finding issues with modern fuels?
None at all so far Neal with the Indian Bullet, but thats only 25 years old although its a 1955 design bike.
Neal wrote: Tue Nov 06, 2018 11:42 am ......... Ive seen the green jelly/deposits in the Alfa carbs but that was when it was left for an extended period.........
Erks, out of interest, how long was the 'extended period' Neal? I was thinking of laying the Indian Bullet up for the winter.
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#264 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

Just over a year Dave, it gummed up the jets and float bowl etc. It may be a good idea to drain the tank and carb. as any ethanol combined with water will corrode where it sits in the tank and float bowl.
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#265 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Dave the bass »

ERks, yeah,I see what you mean. The Bullet might not be on the road for about 3 or 4 months over winter, think I'd get away with it?

I do now realised that I've become a fair-weather-biker, bah! (Shurrups already Phil!) :lol:
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#266 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

You could put some of this on the tank if not draining it: https://www.baysidemarine.co.uk/star-tr ... gKeOPD_BwE

Ooh, or maybe some Briggs and Stratton fuel stabiliser, seriously!
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#267 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Mike H »

Neal wrote: Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:46 pm Just over a year Dave, it gummed up the jets and float bowl etc. It may be a good idea to drain the tank and carb. as any ethanol combined with water will corrode where it sits in the tank and float bowl.
Might be better to fill the tank to the top, put a dash of Star Tron in it, but yes drain the float bowls.
 
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#268 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Mike H »

pre65 wrote: Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:08 pm Now I drain the carb after use, easy on most bikes but not so on carb fitted cars. :cry:
My BMW R80 was easy, as the carbs stick out in the open air, and the float bowls are held on with spring clips. The Guzzi was a PITA, need a 14mm spanner to undo the main jet caps, right side OK but for left side not enough room unless take carb or starter motor off. :shock:
 
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#269 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by thomas »

I was reliably informed a couple of years ago that the Esso super premium stuff was ethanol free.

I haven't seen any green slime in my carburettors after leaving it in my bikes over winter (yet) and it's what my biker group use...
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#270 Re: The Audio-Talk Motorcycling thread.

Post by Neal »

Good info there Thomas! From the Esso website:

“Esso super unleaded petrol (Synergy Supreme+ Unleaded 97) is ethanol free (except in Devon, Cornwall, the Teesside area and Scotland). We would therefore advise anyone who has concerns about the presence of ethanol in petrol to use Synergy Supreme+ – providing they do not fill up in Devon or Cornwall, the Teesside area or Scotland.”
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