Phono bake-off

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

IMO for my experience it wont help you.

How do you know? That's a rhetorical question.

Obviously because it didn't help me or anyone at the tests on a regular basis. Even Choice say they only do it as a marketing exercise as they think it gives them credibility.

[Daniel Quinn]

I think what Ianr and nick are saying , is that better for a person to find out by themselves , so Ianr can keep his eyes closed at the phone meet

And yes I find the gun quote most unsatisfactory and in the case of a gun killing you , biology trumps physics .

[Dave the bass]

Experience is what you gain when looking for something else

Quoth Yoda?!

Should be.

[iansr]

The Harman Group have done extensive research on what makes a speaker sound good using blind testing, albeit using "trained listeners". They have identified the performance characteristics that have the greatest influence on "good sound". The proof of this is that they can now examine the relevant performance measurements of a speaker and predict with a large degree of accuracy how the listeners will rate the speaker. This is consistent with the scientific method. The blind testing is clearly an important element of this research.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

An example of Harman marketing bullshit they are famous for. "Trained Listeners" my arse, are you saying Paul Messenger is not a trained listener

Samsung own Harman now and have done for a year, make of that what you wish.

[pre65]

An example of Harman marketing bullshit they are famous for. "Trained Listeners" my arse, are you saying Paul Messenger is not a trained listener

Well, if he is, who trained him, and does he have a certificate ?

[Nick]

The Harman Group have done extensive research on what makes a speaker sound good using blind testing, albeit using "trained listeners". They have identified the performance characteristics that have the greatest influence on "good sound". The proof of this is that they can now examine the relevant performance measurements of a speaker and predict with a large degree of accuracy how the listeners will rate the speaker. This is consistent with the scientific method. The blind testing is clearly an important element of this research.

I have BBC docs from the 1950's that say the same things about amplifiers. Personally, I think the "training" involves mainly experience and paying attention.

[Daniel Quinn]

Pre most of the people on this forum have moved on from the initial doc joining as got my back up , bloody he'll even mcru as got over it and risen above it . My question is therefore why do remain in absolute cock mode.

[Daniel Quinn]

Anybody here think their opinion on the sound quality of a piece of hifi can be subconsciouly altered by a priori knowledge of the product.

No

Then if you think others can . That be arrogance and stupidity

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Personally I think some people are musically deaf and shouldn't bother with hi-fi - most of those afflicted don't.

All you need in this world is normality, shut off one of the senses and the others respond. I have watched new attendees at blind testing react with obvious stress. Not a good way to listen to music.

One incident oft repeated, I have watched a fairly well know marketing man from KEF in the mid 1990 get into a state of complete confusion because he was scared he would say the wrong thing or not praise his speakers, as I said he went into stress especially after it was obvious the piss was being taken out of him for some of the daft marketing things he was saying, very much like that previous Harmon bullshit.

[andrew Ivimey]

A priori eh giggles - thats just a load of old Kant.

But surely in that way of thinking a prriori knowledge of how a hifi should sound is the nearest to perfection that is, uncoscious knowledge being the divine spark that makes us poor bare forked humans come down from the trees in the first place and start banging the rocks together, a priori makes all other knowledge possible.

Now, who cares - imho we could all be friends and sod the phon stages......

Im a litre of cava laden sangria into a gorgeous sunny evening on a roof terrace overlooking the Plaza Real behind the cathedral and just off La Rambla in one of the worlds very finest cities. It is hard to keep a perspective on riaa equalisation etc etc.

[andrew Ivimey]

Kef man - very sad... it appeals to my wicked side but only just.

[pre65]

Anybody here think their opinion on the sound quality of a piece of hifi can be subconsciouly altered by a priori knowledge of the product.

If it was subconscious how would you know ?

[ed]

Philip why has your quote of DQ's sentence been doctored? It makes no sense anymore.......

[pre65]

Philip why has your quote of DQ's sentence been doctored? It makes no sense anymore.......

Sorry Ed, I did correct the speelong mistooks, but it's back as it was now.