LINN SONDEK LP12

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Rudolph Hucker.
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#1 LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Rudolph Hucker. »

Image

biggest joke in the last 40 years of hifi..
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Flatpopely
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#2 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Flatpopely »

Ok.......I'll bite.

Why?

Seems to have made me enjoy music for the past 30 years well enough.
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#3 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by guy »

+1

about 30 years of enjoying music for me too.

Just don't expect me to try to justify the pricing (now £50 for the rubber band ffs) or the backtracking on original "design principles" when new iteration contradicts.

But still love it and well remember some of the truly awful sounds from direct drive models that I "auditioned" 30 years ago. As for spending £5000 on a dd to make it sound ok, well whatever keeps you happy :bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:
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DSJR
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#4 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by DSJR »

It made shit vinyl sound acceptable and good vinyl very nice indeed. Selling and setting the bloody things was my life for years so I shouldn't complain, but hearing master tape vs acetate vs vinyl and shortly after, hearing a Spacedeck do everything the LP12 did, but far better in every way, even with an RB300 attached - :shock: - and with no setup bullshit did give me an epiphany moment. I suppose I'm a bit like a reformed smoker where the LP12 is concerned now :roll:
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#5 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by cressy »

I dont have an issue wirh the lp12 itsself rather the way it was marketed as the one and only.
And the cost now.
A top spec one 30 years ago in 1987 with a tick tock and whatever cart was in vogue at the time would probably have run to about a grand ish. Adjusted for inflation that is around 2 grand today.
When you consider that a top spec one today is about 18 grand it seems an absurd amout of money to pay, and is probably why the old ones hold their money so well. I really dont think there is an appreciable difference in a 30 year old one and a brand new one, and when you can get something like an sme model 15 for a third of the 18k price tag, the lp12 makes no sense.
To me you would really have to be a linn die hard these days to buy a new one.
Though if you have one and are happy with it, then who is anyone else to tell you you can do better?.

Cheers ant
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#6 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by steve s »

May be a good time to get mine on ebay Ant..

Or at least give it some use ?
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#7 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by pre65 »

Don't think I've ever heard an LP12, so can't comment.

But, I would find setting it up regularly a right royal pain in the butt.
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Rudolph Hucker.
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#8 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Rudolph Hucker. »

anyone here had a proper listen to a top spec one made today?

i had a lingo ekos arkiv once back in 1991..utter heapa shite was slaughtered by me mates 1200
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#9 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by cressy »

Give it some use steve thats what its for :D
Then decide what to do with it
Nowt wrong with the deck, its all the hype and bullshit that comes with them that I dont like. Some people swear by them and some dont, i just cant see why it should cost so much for a brand new one
The used values for them have always been strong, they have the right name and status to assure strong resale value even in pretty poor condition.
I havent heard one for years to be honest, the one i had got replaced with a yamaha pf 800, that went, and I havent had a belt driven deck in the system since. Have a td160 here waiting for restoration when i get round to it, there isnt much difference.
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#10 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by guy »

DSJR wrote:It made shit vinyl sound acceptable and good vinyl very nice indeed. Selling and setting the bloody things was my life for years so I shouldn't complain, but hearing master tape vs acetate vs vinyl and shortly after, hearing a Spacedeck do everything the LP12 did, but far better in every way, even with an RB300 attached - :shock: - and with no setup bullshit did give me an epiphany moment. I suppose I'm a bit like a reformed smoker where the LP12 is concerned now :roll:
Funnily enough, I was looking at "signals" hifi web site before you posted this (looking into replacement cartridge). I guess that you will know the dealer as he is close to both of us in Suffolk Dave.

I noticed the Spacedeck and did go through the "what if my LP12 had to be replaced" thought process. At the price of ~ £1500 for the Ace, a current LP12 wouldn't even get a look in.

Guy.
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#11 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Neal »

Rudolph Hucker. wrote:anyone here had a proper listen to a top spec one made today?

i had a lingo ekos arkiv once back in 1991..utter heapa shite was slaughtered by me mates 1200
Yes I have, it's a very good deck but a very expensive one. One that can be matched or bettered for less, maybe a lot less.

Back in the day I had an Ekos/Arkiv/Lingo for many years, I owned the deck for about 18years in total. Eventually, when I compared it to a GyroSE with Orbe mods and NC PSU I sold it.

Years later I heard the latest spec. LP12 it was totally different to my old deck, much better.
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#12 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Daniel Quinn »

Pretty sure Bill Gates founded Microsoft's monopoly marketing strategy after studying the LP12 marketing in the 70's and 80's

Pretty sure that the LP12 is as always been a middle ranking overpriced turntable , that is enjoyable. The contention that is sets the standards for all other turntables to aspire to is bollocks and as always been bollocks.

Pretty sure that springs in compression and a motor fixed to the top plate connected to the subchasis by a rubber belt are the limiting factor in the design .
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#13 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by Rudolph Hucker. »

baked bean tin sub chassis was a total joke
now we have the keel..total bargain 2k for a piece of alloy :evil:
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DSJR
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#14 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by DSJR »

I'm pretty sure the LP12 in the 70's was about as good as belt drives got!* Maybe that's not saying much, but the basic technical performance (suspension dynamics aside which were never discussed until The Doc gave his carefully researched view) was actually very good - low w&f, very well engineered and quiet main bearing offering low rumble figures (when Thorens and AR bearings had developed too much slop) and the sheer mass of the platter did work at the time...

What ruined it was the forcible selling to get it noticed and then all the fanboys like me jumping on and creating this millstone that won't erode quick enough.

Back in the 70's, we didn't care about support structures for turntable systems apart from some enterprising souls bolting their Garrard 301's and 401's to concrete paving slabs in an attempt to quieten transmitted drive noise down (then they were almost worthless). I think there was mention of half-squash balls being used to aid isolation, but most of this was because of howl-round acoustic feedback, which my otherwise delightful Technics SL110/SME suffered from badly. Late 70's Jap dd's were rather good at the top of the tree, but for whatever reason (it can't be the LP12's fault surely?), less and less of the good ones found their way to these shores I remember.

By the early 80's, we began to hear of European cord or massive belt driven decks such as the Audio Labor (was the Platine Verdier available in the early 80's?), and the US was travelling in that direction too with some heavyweights (SOTA, VPI?). The LP12 in its home market had the Systemdek, Roksan and early PT's to worry about and I don't think it's regarded with the same reverence away from UK shores anyway. Respected yes, but not revered (or reviled).


As an aside, Something I read elsewhere today. A pro speaker manufacturer apparently wants to enter the profitable domestic arena with some $12000 domestic speakers otherwise identical inside to their $2500 pro model apart from cabinetwork. The only difference is a bit of bling on show. I think Linn are now in this category, milking the old deck for as much as they can get away with, although I suggest sales of LP12's is in hundreds if that per year now - they're not apparently selling many speakers worldwide either according to figures AVI 'accidentally' got hold of from their mutual cabinet maker.
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#15 Re: LINN SONDEK LP12

Post by cressy »

I built an lp12 without a subchassis years ago. It was in a solid laminate plinth made of birch ply and perspex it ended up in my opinion better sounding than it was originally.
I also built an idler out of an lp12 and a gl69.
That thing was abit mental.
Some pics of them both on my website
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