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Anything to do with the things that make the music we listen to.
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Paul Barker
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Post by Paul Barker » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:32 pm

Materials choice is proved significant to sound by other key influences such as kondo. If plastic doesn't sound as good as wood it would make an incremental difference over all. He also mentions the plastics in pickups are better replaced, but stops short of saying what with. Resin i suppose.

Please don't associate him with Peter Belt?
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Paul Barker
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Post by Paul Barker » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:33 pm

Materials choice is proved significant to sound by other key influences such as kondo. If plastic doesn't sound as good as wood it would make an incremental difference over all. He also mentions the plastics in pickups are better replaced, but stupid short of saying what with. Resin i suppose.

Please don't associate him with Peter Belt? I
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Post by Paul Barker » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:33 pm

I agree the ss gear it's over priced. But he has diy ideas also such as the tone arm (Altmann) and vinyl spinner. His talk about natural resins like c41 is backed up in other places, and he isn't the only person to value paper cones in speakers. Overall what he has written has been one of the influences behind my thinking all along. All of the material on his die is a good 10 years old.
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ed
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Post by ed » Mon Jul 02, 2012 5:56 pm

I'm sorry Paul, but I just plain have to disagree. I know I wouldn't be able to tell the difference or fault the plastic, but I fully accept there may be virtuoso players that may identify shortcomings in the plastic. To me it seems like one of those things whereby when you can play it convincingly, and after you've tried every amplifier in the world and every possible setting, then move on to more esoteric areas to search for why it's coming up short.

If there'd been a genuine problem I think it would have been addressed sometime in the last 50 years.

I know Mick Ronson took the paint off the top of his Les Paul but at the time I put it down to English eccentricity. Even so I wouldn't have argued with him if he'd said there was a difference. But this BYOB chap is not Mick Ronson, so as far as I'm concerned he's got a solution that's looking for a problem....
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Post by Paul Barker » Mon Jul 02, 2012 7:51 pm

If Stradivarius was alive he would be using plastic then?
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Nick
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Post by Nick » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:19 pm

If Stradivarius was alive he would be using plastic then?
He might do for the bits that have little or no impact on the sound. There is a big difference in the effect that the body materials used between a strat and (say) an archtop.

Also worth pointing out that many players use plastic picks.

IMHO, part of what make a strat a strat is its faults, fix them and you end up with a different instrument, and maybe not as good a one.
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Post by Paul Barker » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:24 pm

i agree that it is a less significant part and an incremental difference. but I don't agree it makes no difference which is what Ed must believe to disagree with my original statement.

I can agree that you may prefer the difference.
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david C
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Post by david C » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:42 pm

Nick wrote:

IMHO, part of what make a strat a strat is its faults, fix them and you end up with a different instrument, and maybe not as good a one.
the stratocaster has been going for nearly 60 years and has been used by people responsible for ground breaking music over the 60 odd years, anything and everything has been tried on it over the years but it still remains largely the same,

funny thing is that there is a awful lot of 54-62 reissues being sold maybe they know something this guy doesn't,

maybe a wooden pickguard would change the sound but it isn't something most users would want,
David

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Post by david C » Mon Jul 02, 2012 9:42 pm

ed wrote: I know Mick Ronson took the paint off the top of his Les Paul but at the time I put it down to English eccentricity. Even so I wouldn't have argued with him if he'd said there was a difference. But this BYOB chap is not Mick Ronson, so as far as I'm concerned he's got a solution that's looking for a problem....
funnily enough there is a movement that says bare wood strats sound better, Fender charge $18000 for replicas with very little finish on them,
the finish I'm putting on this body is designed to let the wood breath and not stifle the sustain which a lacquer finish would do

what make you think I'm a sucker for a good story

mind you an awful lot of guitars are finished using oil with added varnish a typical example is Tru-oil which is mainly used on walnut rifle stocks

violins can also be finished using it too, if it had been available 300years ago guess who might have used it
David

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Post by ed » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:49 am

Paul Barker wrote:i agree that it is a less significant part and an incremental difference. but I don't agree it makes no difference which is what Ed must believe to disagree with my original statement.

I can agree that you may prefer the difference.
Hi Paul

I didn't say or believe that it makes no difference. The point I was making was that I couldn't tell the difference, along with nine tenths of the rest of the world. As Nick pointed out, even if it did make a difference, it would be a different instrument.

As regards the violins I don't think it's relevant to the discussion because their tops are soundwood and the thickness and content directly affect the sound of the instrument. However, to be pedantic, Darryl Way got a very nice sound out of his plastic version as I recall...

On reflection, I don't think I feel strongly enough about the subject to argue the point. We(humans) do loads of things for no other reason than 'because we can' , whether they're meaningful or not. As I wrote in one of those silly songs, ' it stops us from going insane'....

:)

edit: http://www.cooperowen.co.uk/auction_det ... _id=100124
Last edited by ed on Tue Jul 03, 2012 1:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Dave the bass » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:56 am

Aye, Ornette Coleman played a plastic Sax too and made it sound great (IMO). Just saying like :-)

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Paul Barker
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Post by Paul Barker » Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:21 pm

Well I do know that it is primarily as Martin Bundle said about Shoe Maker "the most important part is the nut behind the wheel".

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Post by shane » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:06 pm

It's not the size or the age that seem weird, it's the suit and tie!

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andrew Ivimey
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Post by andrew Ivimey » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:54 pm

osmondosis? I'd like to know the story!
Philosophers have only interpreted the world - the point, however, is to change it. No it isn't ... maybe we should leave it alone for a while.

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Post by Nick » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:16 pm

andrew Ivimey wrote:osmondosis? I'd like to know the story!
Is that a disease that infects Mormons making them believe they are the king of kings?
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