audio-talk

^^^Bill and Gong use the same bassist by the looks of it, thats Dave Sturt in that clip.

I'd love to hear Miles Davis 'correct' Derek Bailey improvs!

I thought some of the metaphysical imagery was really particularly effective.
And interesting ... rhythmic devices ... which seemed to counterpoint the surrealism of the underlying metaphor of the players' compassionate soul, which strives through the medium of the verse structure to sublimate this, transcend that, and come to terms with the fundamental dichotomies of whatever the piece was about

In all seriousness, I reckon that would have been an absolute brilliant gig to be at and witness that sound live with others.

I struggle listening to Derek Bailey at home, but live, with a drummer/accompanist like that I reckon that could be 'phwooooooooooaaaaaaaaaarrrrr'.

Derek Bailey's work is too much for me to handle.
You sometimes get more than just a hint of it with some of Zappa's earlier works, but there you have the safety net of things breaking into a beautiful melody, or segueing into something else with more structure.

I'd have enjoyed the riot of percussion for a minute or two, and then made for the door, only to find that Derek's disappearance was to lock it, and thus prevent a massed audience escape.

Maybe come at through history, I can hear so much of the last 50 years of music in this.

The Stratmangler wrote: ↑Thu Aug 30, 2018 10:43 pm ......only to find that Derek's disappearance was to lock it, and thus prevent a massed audience escape.

Ha! Or....Maybe he locked the door to stop a massed audience arrival because what they were about to play is very important and they really really really want to get the message across and only those that arrived on time are worthy to witness the message.

Dave the bass wrote: ↑Fri Aug 31, 2018 8:12 amHa! Or....Maybe he locked the door to stop a massed audience arrival because what they were about to play is very important and they really really really want to get the message across and only those that arrived on time are worthy to witness the message.

But wouldn't that action be premeditated, and therefore the opposite of free improvisation?

The Stratmangler wrote: ↑Fri Aug 31, 2018 9:44 am But wouldn't that action be premeditated, and therefore the opposite of free improvisation?

Only if they did it every time.

Wow, I'm learning things on this thread.
Thanks Ray for the Bill nelson - very fine.
Derek Bailey - just been reading his Wikipedia page - very interesting.

Tricky 'Strugglin' .
First heard this track playing in a HMV in Chester in 95 or 96. It's haunted me ever since. Played it again a couple of weeks ago and it's been going round my head resurfacing in quiet moments.
Minimalist/layered/sinister. This is Art and Music.
Will not be to everybody's taste !

Nick wrote: ↑Fri Aug 31, 2018 10:44 am

The Stratmangler wrote: ↑Fri Aug 31, 2018 9:44 am But wouldn't that action be premeditated, and therefore the opposite of free improvisation?

Only if they did it every time.

'They'?

The audience or the artistes?

I reckon both want the same thing, communication.

because what they were about to play is very important

So you can use they without any problem, but the moment I do it it gets questioned.

'They'?

Typical double standard, just what I have come to expect...

Hot dang! You've got me there guv, bang 't' rights etc etc.

OK, what I meant was, in the 1st instance was that was it the audience or the performers being expected to improvise?

I think true improv relies on now, here, action, response, listen, react. So I wanted to understand if it was the audience or the artists that you were referring to in your answer to Chris's quote.

Just to further shoot myself in the foot I suppose It could be both, I've been involved in improv that has involved me as part of the audience ending up playing music at an improv night.

S'good here innit

Yes, there is a symmetry. Is the artist performing for the audience, or t'other way around.

In May 1965 as a small child I was taken by my stepfather to see Andrés Segovia playing a recital on his Hauser II at the Fairfield Halls in London. I was 7, he was about 70.

Although I was only just getting interested in music generally, it was a formative moment in my life. The audience even applauded his tune-up - I couldn't understand why....

...then he started to play...